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Comments on the AP College Football Poll: December 3, 2023

1) Michigan 13-0
2) Washington 13-0
3) Texas 12-1
4) Florida State 13-0
5) Alabama 12-1
6) Georgia 12-1
7) Ohio State 11-1
8) Oregon 11-2
9) Missouri 10-2
10) Penn State 10-2
11) Mississippi 10-2
12) Oklahoma 10-2
13) Louisiana State 9-3
14) Arizona 9-3
15) Notre Dame 9-3
16) Louisville 10-3
17) Southern Methodist 11-2
18) Liberty 13-0
19) North Carolina State 9-3
20) Iowa 10-3
21) Oregon State 8-4
22) Oklahoma State 9-4
23) Tulane 11-2
24) James Madison 11-1
25) Tennessee 8-4

Others Receiving Votes
Clemson 8-4
Troy 11-2
Utah 8-4
Kansas State 8-4
Miami (Ohio) 11-2
Toledo 11-2
Kansas 8-4
Kentucky 7-5
If you've been wondering why I haven't been fixing the AP college football poll every week, it's because I don't bother to fix the AP poll's top 25 until after the final edition is released in January. When there are no more games to be played, there is no longer any wiggle room for ignoring head-to-head results and season-long performance. But before that, there can be plenty of room for wiggling.

For example, I think that 10-3 Iowa is still overrated at #20, given their loss to 5-7 Minnesota and the fact that they haven't beaten a single rated or even nearly-rated team. On top of that, their performance has been consistently putrid, as they have barely won game after game after game against extremely weak opponents. However, if Iowa defeats #25 Tennessee in the Citrus Bowl, then the sports writers will have been proven right, and if Iowa loses, then the Hawkeyes will drop in the ratings anyway, so this issue will largely take care of itself one way or the other.

Obviously, while I will not fix the AP poll until January, it is late enough in the season that I now feel comfortable commenting on the weekly poll. I will go ahead and point out problems with the poll that would be outright errors if the season had ended this last weekend, and no more games were to be played. This can also give voters (in the AP or in any other poll) an idea of potential errors to avoid going forward.

Playoff Committee Rankings

Count me among those who vehemently disagree with the College Football Playoff (CFP) committee leaving Florida State out of the playoffs. This wasn't just stupid, it was wrong. They should be ashamed of themselves. I'll comment a bit more on this issue, as well as compare the CFP top 25 to the AP poll's top 25, at the end of the article below.

Because the playoff committee will not be ranking teams in a final post-bowl top 25, I will not be fixing any of their rankings like I will the final AP poll top 25 in January, and for that reason, I will not be fully commenting on the playoff committee's top 25.

Now let's get to commenting on the problems with the latest AP poll...

Florida State

The AP poll, unlike the CFP committee, ranked 13-0 FSU in their top 4. They were right to do so, but there is still a problem here. 12-1 Texas has suddenly leapt 4 spots in the AP poll, and now sits just in front of FSU at #3. For beating #22 Oklahoma State? This makes no sense at all, and I have never seen anything like this happen in the AP poll before. I think that a bunch of writers were playing at being playoff committee selectors here.

This is pretty simple. Texas beat Alabama, and that is great, but they also lost to #12 Oklahoma. FSU has not taken an upset loss. They finished one game better than Texas for the season, and they should be ranked ahead of Texas.

And let's be clear on one issue: FSU having an injured player is itself not a legitimate reason to rate them lower. This should never be a criterion for rating any team.

Of course, if Florida State loses to Georgia in the Orange Bowl, as seems likely, then this issue becomes irrelevant.

Ohio State

The AP poll also jumped Texas up ahead of 11-1 Ohio State this week, and I repeat: for beating #22 Oklahoma State? Again, Texas took a loss to #12 Oklahoma, while Ohio State lost only to #1 Michigan. Ohio State therefore had a relevant record that was effectively one game better than that of Texas for the season. Only 2 of Ohio State's wins were close (touchdown or less), both against top 25 opponents, while Texas posted 3 close wins, 2 of them over unrated opponents.

Still, I suppose that if Ohio State loses to Missouri in the Cotton Bowl, or if Texas wins both playoff games, then the writers will be proven right here.

Oregon

11-2 Oregon was also passed up by Texas in this week's AP poll, and Oregon also has a better relevant record than Texas does, as both of their losses have come to #2 Washington (and both by just 3 points). However, Oregon has only beaten one rated opponent, and that team is only ranked #21, so I suppose that dropping Oregon behind Texas and Alabama works. Still, it should be noted that Oregon could be legitimately ranked higher than Texas, even if it's not the best choice.

Louisiana State > Missouri

Here is an issue I covered last week. 9-3 Louisiana State (#13) defeated 10-2 Missouri (#9) by 10 points on the road, and they should therefore be rated higher than Missouri. All 3 of LSU's losses have come to teams ranked in the top 11, and Missouri's best win has come over a team ranked #25, so there's just no excuse for Missouri to be ranked higher. Furthermore, Missouri has 4 close wins (touchdown or less), all over unranked opponents, while LSU has posted just 1 close win. Very poor job by the sports writers here, possibly the worst ranking decision in this top 25.

Needless to say, 10-2 Mississippi (#11), who has beaten LSU, should also be rated higher than Missouri.

Oklahoma

Also covered last week. 10-2 Oklahoma, who sits right in front of 9-3 LSU at #12, should also be dropped behind LSU. Oklahoma may have a better straight record, but OU has taken 2 upset losses to lower-ranked teams, and LSU has taken no upset losses, so LSU has a better relevant record than that of Oklahoma, and that is what should matter here.

Tennessee > Kentucky > Louisville > Notre Dame > North Carolina State

This is another head-to-head issue I covered last week. 8-4 Tennessee (#25) defeated 7-5 Kentucky (#33), who defeated 10-3 Louisville (#16), who defeated 9-3 Notre Dame (#15), who defeated 9-3 North Carolina State (#19), and that is the order in which these teams should be ranked, as shown in the heading above. Let's start with the heart of this matter:

Kentucky > Louisville

Kentucky (outside the AP poll's top 25 at #33) may be 7-5 and Louisville (#16) 10-3, but don't be blinded by those straight records:Kentucky should be rated ahead of Louisville due to beating them 38-31 on the road last week. Kentucky's straight record is worse solely because they played a far more difficult schedule. Kentucky has taken an upset loss (17-14 to 5-7 South Carolina), but so has Louisville (38-21 to 3-9 Pittsburgh). All but 1 of Kentucky's wins came by more than a touchdown (the exception being their win at Louisville), while Louisville posted 4 close wins over unranked opponents. This case just doesn't look close to me. Still, if Kentucky loses to Clemson in the Gator Bowl, and if Louisville defeats Southern Cal in the Holiday Bowl, then I suppose the AP voters will be proven correct.

Tennessee

8-4 Tennessee (#25), who defeated Kentucky, should of course also be rated higher than 10-3 Louisville. Tennessee and Louisville have each taken 1 upset loss (Tennessee to 5-7 Florida; Louisville, again, to 3-9 Pitt). The difference between these teams is the fact that Tennessee beat Kentucky 33-27 on the road, while Louisville lost to Kentucky 38-31 at home. And like Kentucky, Tennessee performed better than Louisville did.

So Tennessee > Kentucky > Louisville.

Louisville > Notre Dame

10-3 Louisville (#16) defeated 9-3 Notre Dame 33-20, and they should therefore be rated ahead of the Irish. The AP poll thoughtlessly dropped Louisville just behind Notre Dame this week. This is one the CFP committee got right. Still, various bowl game results could lead to Notre Dame meriting a higher ranking than Louisville when all is said and done. As of now, though, Louisville should be ranked higher.

Southern Methodist

11-2 Southern Methodist was overrated at #25 last week; they are terribly overrated at #17 this week. Somehow, beating Tulane (who I deemed to be overrated last week) has jumped them up eight spots! Imagine if they had beaten a legitimate top 25 team! As I said last week, SMU lost 34-17 to 5-7 Texas Christian, and I don't see any reason for them to be rated higher than TCU, which is to say, out of the top 25.

Beating #23 Tulane does not impress me, because Tulane hasn't beaten anyone that matters themselves (more on them below). Tulane should be dropped out of the top 25 as well, behind TCU with SMU.

13-0 Liberty has taken no upset losses, and I do not understand why the AP poll placed 11-2 SMU just ahead of them. Last week the AP rankings did the same thing with Tulane. Do the writers have a problem with Liberty?

The CFP committee has SMU ranked seven places lower. They did a far better job on this one.

One last note: SMU beating 6-6 Boston College in the Fenway Bowl would prove absolutely nothing. SMU should finish unranked regardless of what happens in the bowl games.

Iowa

10-3 Iowa is still overrated. Iowa has taken an upset loss (to 5-7 Minnesota), and their performances have been relentlessly awful all season. Their other losses were inept shutouts, 31-0 to Penn State and 26-0 to Michigan, and they have posted 5 close wins over unrated opponents, including a pair of wins by 2 and 3 points over losing teams in their last 2 regular season games. Iowa has done nothing at all to merit being ranked, and they should not be ranked.

Of course, if Iowa defeats 8-4 Tennessee (#25) in the Citrus Bowl, then I suppose they will have proven the AP pollsters correct, and will have earned their spot in the rankings.

Tulane

11-2 Tulane was overrated last week, and they remain overrated at #23 this week. As stated above, SMU does not belong in a top 25, and Tulane just lost 26-14 to SMU at home, so they also do not belong in a top 25. Tulane just hasn't beaten anyone of value, and they've posted a lot of poor performances (close wins over 4-8 Tulsa, 2-10 East Carolina, 6-6 Rice, and 5-7 North Texas).

Needless to say, Tulane beating 6-6 Virginia Tech in their bowl game would do nothing to help their cause.

James Madison

Also covered last week. 11-1 James Madison (#24) did beat a decent team in 11-2 Troy. However, James Madison has an upset loss to 8-5 Appalachian State dragging them down, and they only beat Troy by 2 points, whereas Kansas State (just outside the top 25 at #29) stomped on Troy 42-13. I have to think that KSU, at the least, should be rated higher than James Madison, and that alone would likely leave JM just outside a legit top 25.

Beating 8-4 Air Force in their bowl game would do nothing for them.

Utah, Clemson, Kansas State, and Kansas

Repeating what I said here last week, we have at least 4 teams in the AP poll's top 25 that should not be ranked at all, as covered above. Who should we replace them with? Well, as I indicated above, Kentucky and Tennessee should be rated ahead of Louisville, so that's 2 teams that would replace some of the teams that need to be shown the door. Other teams that would be better inclusions in a top 25 than some of the teams covered above include Utah, Clemson, Kansas State, and Kansas.

8-4 Utah (#28) took all 4 of their losses to teams ranked in the top 21, so they have a better relevant record than do #17 SMU, #19 North Carolina State, #20 Iowa, #22 Oklahoma State, and #24 James Madison, all of whom have taken upset losses to unranked teams.

8-4 Clemson (#26) has taken a pair of upset losses to unranked teams, but they made up for one of them with an upset win over #15 Notre Dame. They also beat 8-4 North Carolina 31-20.

8-4 Kansas State (#29) has taken 1 upset loss, in their finale to 7-5 Iowa State, but their performances have otherwise been extremely strong, including losses at #3 Texas and at #9 Missouri by just 3 points each. They also own wins over 8-4 Kansas and 11-2 Troy, the latter by a big score of 42-13.

8-4 Kansas (#32) has taken an upset loss to 6-6 Texas Tech, but they made up for it with a big upset win over #12 Oklahoma.

Troy, Miami (Ohio), and Toledo

Troy, Miami (Ohio), and Toledo are all 11-2, and they are all sitting just outside the AP poll's top 25. As such, they are all well positioned to finish ranked as other teams fall out of their way. But all 3 of these teams are playing useless opponents in their bowl games, and none of these teams should finish ranked regardless of what happens in any bowl games.

11-2 Troy (#27) belongs ranked behind the teams that beat them, 8-4 Kansas State (#29) and 11-1 James Madison (#24). Beating 7-5 Duke in their bowl game would do nothing to change that. And it is a joke that KSU sits behind Troy now, given that they stomped on Troy 42-13 this season.

11-2 Miami-Ohio (#30) was stomped 38-3 by 7-5 Miami-Florida, and they should definitely be ranked behind the Hurricanes, which is to say, they should be unranked. Beating 8-5 Appalachian State in their bowl game wouldn't even merit a yawn.

11-2 Toledo (#31) just lost to Miami-Ohio, so needless to say, they also belong ranked behind Miami-Florida, well out of the top 25. More than that, Toledo lost to 5-7 Illinois, and they should be ranked behind the Illini. Beating 8-4 Wyoming in their bowl game would offer no help.

Comments on the College Football Playoff Rankings

I thought the CFP rankings were just a bit better than the AP poll's rankings last week, but this week I think that the CFP rankings are a lot better than the AP poll's rankings. This week, I would say that there are 9 relevant differences between the two rankings, and the CFP committee outdid the AP poll on 7 of the 9.

Unfortunately, like last week, the CFP top 25 replicates a pretty bad error that the AP poll makes, placing Missouri 4 places higher than LSU, who beat them by 10 on the road. Look, this is pretty simple: according to the CFP's own rankings, Missouri lost to the #5 and #13 teams, and the best team they defeated is ranked #21. If I were to ask a bunch of 4th graders where such a team should be ranked, they would universally, and correctly, say somewhere between #14 and #20. And yet a room full of adults with college degrees cannot understand this simple logic? And we are letting this utterly inept group select who goes to the playoffs? I find that very disturbing.

I understand the AP poll making this mistake, because the sports writers don't have much time to rank teams after the Saturday games, and they have always ranked teams based mostly on feelings and straight record and when losses happened. And really, their ranking is just for fun anyway. Nothing is really at stake. The CFP rankings, however, matter a great deal, and more time goes into it, and supposedly more thought goes into it as well, and so this type of basic lack of logic is, in my opinion, inexcusable. I don't think that anyone who makes such a judgment as ranking Missouri higher than LSU should have anything to do with selecting which teams go to playoffs and which don't.

And speaking of that, let's get to this year's big controversy/travesty...

Florida State Was Robbed

What happened to Florida State is terrible. It is stupid, and it is morally wrong. FSU was basically disqualified for having a player injury. How is this right?

Last week, the CFP committee had FSU rated #4 and Texas #7. This week, FSU beat #15 Louisville and Texas beat #20 Oklahoma State (CFP rankings), and somehow Texas has jumped 4 spots to #3, ahead of FSU. How does this make any sense at all?

The committee's spokesperson offered a terrible excuse, and that is the fact that FSU lost their starting quarterback 3 games ago. But that was true last week, when FSU was #4 and Texas #7. Why does it matter now if it didn't matter last week, or the week before that?

Utter and complete bullshit.

At least the AP poll had FSU in their top 4, so I'm going to say that the AP poll did slightly better on this issue.

Iowa

The CFP rankings put Iowa #17, the AP poll #20, and as I wrote in the preceding article, Iowa should not be ranked at all, so the AP poll also did a bit better on this issue.

Louisville and Notre Dame

As I wrote in the preceding article, 10-3 Louisville beat 9-3 Notre Dame 33-20, and they should therefore be rated higher than Notre Dame. The CFP committee put Louisville just ahead of Notre Dame, the AP poll just behind, so the CFP committee did a much better job on this issue.

Little Big Teams

The CFP rankings have always tended to rank "Little Big Teams," or teams from minor conferences, much lower than the AP poll rankings have. This year the CFP rankings have Liberty #23 (AP #18), SMU #24 (AP #17), Tulane unranked (AP #23), and James Madison unranked (AP #24). As I noted in the preceding article, SMU, Tulane, and James Madison should not be ranked, so the CFP committee obviously did a far better job on these teams than the AP poll did. Also noted in the article above, 13-0 Liberty should definitely be ranked higher than 11-2 SMU, who lost 34-17 to a 5-7 team, and the CFP committee correctly put Liberty ahead of SMU, while the AP poll bafflingly jumped SMU 8 places upward this week, ahead of Liberty.

The CFP committee's approach to "Little Big Teams" has been very consistent over the years: they just really don't like minor conference teams. Most of the time, they are right. The AP poll definitely has a bad habit of overrating Little Big Teams with nice-looking straight records. However, sometimes, when a Little Big Team deserves to be ranked highly, the CFP committee still ranks them lower than the AP poll does, so what we have here is simply an unthinking bias against Little Big Teams that just happens to work out most of the time.

Tennessee, Clemson, and Kansas State

The CFP committee has Tennessee #21 (AP #25), Clemson #22 (AP #26), and Kansas State #25 (AP #29), besting the AP poll's placement in all 3 cases. Clemson and KSU are replaced by Tulane and James Madison in the AP poll's top 25, and as I've just indicated, those teams should not be ranked.

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